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	<title>Comments on: Banks train their guns on start-up 22seven</title>
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	<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/</link>
	<description>South Africa&#039;s technology news leader</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 16 May 2012 18:39:00 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Derek Hohls</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69653</link>
		<dc:creator>Derek Hohls</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 11:35:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69653</guid>
		<description>Isn&#039;t that the whole point here?  The Banks say that there cannot be APIs because of the security issues... some comments above suggest there could be other reasons.  But, yes, this next decade will see a massive push from &quot;digital consumers&quot; for APIs for everything from banks and buses to weather and yachts!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Isn&#8217;t that the whole point here?  The Banks say that there cannot be APIs because of the security issues&#8230; some comments above suggest there could be other reasons.  But, yes, this next decade will see a massive push from &#8220;digital consumers&#8221; for APIs for everything from banks and buses to weather and yachts!</p>
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		<title>By: Andre Bruton</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69648</link>
		<dc:creator>Andre Bruton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 10:28:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69648</guid>
		<description>Where are the banks API&#039;s? Imaging what we could do if banks had API&#039;s... all the startups and services</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Where are the banks API&#8217;s? Imaging what we could do if banks had API&#8217;s&#8230; all the startups and services</p>
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		<title>By: ps</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69638</link>
		<dc:creator>ps</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 01 Feb 2012 07:40:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69638</guid>
		<description>It&#039;ll be a cold day in hell before a south african bank takes responsibility for fraud even from within its own ranks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;ll be a cold day in hell before a south african bank takes responsibility for fraud even from within its own ranks.</p>
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		<title>By: WMD</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69625</link>
		<dc:creator>WMD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 14:22:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69625</guid>
		<description>I have to agree 100% with Nicky Cornish as well as with Raj.  Also with so many phishing scams and banks trying to raise more awareness. I believe the timing for this product is bad.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to agree 100% with Nicky Cornish as well as with Raj.  Also with so many phishing scams and banks trying to raise more awareness. I believe the timing for this product is bad.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan Benington</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69619</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Benington</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 10:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69619</guid>
		<description>Its not about bank fees. Its about financial services broadly - &quot;product penetration&quot;. Home loans, asset finance, short and long term insurance are the products for which high value clients are good consumers and good risk.

A single customer view is what none of the banks have (some of them not even within their own group) and is what will expose opportunities. Especially when this customer view can be seen relative to  other people of the same profile. 

Maybe 22seven is not about this in the short term. But this potential is what the banks fear and should really be taking on themselves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Its not about bank fees. Its about financial services broadly &#8211; &#8220;product penetration&#8221;. Home loans, asset finance, short and long term insurance are the products for which high value clients are good consumers and good risk.</p>
<p>A single customer view is what none of the banks have (some of them not even within their own group) and is what will expose opportunities. Especially when this customer view can be seen relative to  other people of the same profile. </p>
<p>Maybe 22seven is not about this in the short term. But this potential is what the banks fear and should really be taking on themselves.</p>
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		<title>By: Greg Mahlknecht</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69618</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg Mahlknecht</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 06:13:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69618</guid>
		<description>I still don&#039;t quite get how 22seven is a big threat to the banks.  If you take a few minutes to read their pricing plans and choose one that suits you, they&#039;re all pretty much of a muchness - and they&#039;re not hidden, anyway, so the whole bank fees point isn&#039;t relevant to the discussion.  

22seven tries to help a client change their spending habits.  It has nothing to do with the bank.  If you think that changing to another bank will magically make you spend less on entertainment or groceries, then there&#039;s something fundamentally wrong with your thinking.  Yes, it might make you spend a little less on your credit card or pay your mortgage off faster, but unless you&#039;re going to take the saved cash out and keep it in your matress, the bank still has it in their coffers and is doing stuff with it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I still don&#8217;t quite get how 22seven is a big threat to the banks.  If you take a few minutes to read their pricing plans and choose one that suits you, they&#8217;re all pretty much of a muchness &#8211; and they&#8217;re not hidden, anyway, so the whole bank fees point isn&#8217;t relevant to the discussion.  </p>
<p>22seven tries to help a client change their spending habits.  It has nothing to do with the bank.  If you think that changing to another bank will magically make you spend less on entertainment or groceries, then there&#8217;s something fundamentally wrong with your thinking.  Yes, it might make you spend a little less on your credit card or pay your mortgage off faster, but unless you&#8217;re going to take the saved cash out and keep it in your matress, the bank still has it in their coffers and is doing stuff with it.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan Benington</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69617</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Benington</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2012 04:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69617</guid>
		<description>Greg, I think that its the aggregated knowledge that the Banks are scared of. That knowledge can be used to guide their high-value customers to be more efficient and less &#039;loyal&#039;. This will inevitably lead to greater competition, lowered fees and higher churn rates in the market that is their most profitable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Greg, I think that its the aggregated knowledge that the Banks are scared of. That knowledge can be used to guide their high-value customers to be more efficient and less &#8216;loyal&#8217;. This will inevitably lead to greater competition, lowered fees and higher churn rates in the market that is their most profitable.</p>
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		<title>By: Greg Mahlknecht</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69612</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg Mahlknecht</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jan 2012 17:04:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69612</guid>
		<description>&gt;&quot;Why haven&#039;t they sat down with the banks?&quot; 

They&#039;re going to have to confront them sooner or later.  Really stupid waiting after launch to do it.  22seven has started their relationships with all the banks on the wrong foot.  The banks had no choice but to warn everyone against this unknown site asking for bank login details.  22seven should have at the very least have given the banks concerned an audited report of their systems and partners weeks ago, wherein their security procedures and controls were documented, then they&#039;d have some ammunition to play the victim, rather than coming off looking like amateurs.

&gt;. &quot;Sure Christo, we think our customers being able to see a complete picture of their banking charges is a great idea&quot;. 

I don&#039;t know why people keep going on about the bank charges being exposed as if the banks hide and obfuscate them like a dirty secret.  On my bank statements (from FNB) it has a whole column dedicated to them!  It has &quot;Amount/Balance/Accrued Bank Charges&quot; columns - and it also has another entry where it actually adds them up and takes them from your account.  I really don&#039;t see how 22seven could make this any clearer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt;&#8221;Why haven&#8217;t they sat down with the banks?&#8221; </p>
<p>They&#8217;re going to have to confront them sooner or later.  Really stupid waiting after launch to do it.  22seven has started their relationships with all the banks on the wrong foot.  The banks had no choice but to warn everyone against this unknown site asking for bank login details.  22seven should have at the very least have given the banks concerned an audited report of their systems and partners weeks ago, wherein their security procedures and controls were documented, then they&#8217;d have some ammunition to play the victim, rather than coming off looking like amateurs.</p>
<p>&gt;. &#8220;Sure Christo, we think our customers being able to see a complete picture of their banking charges is a great idea&#8221;. </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know why people keep going on about the bank charges being exposed as if the banks hide and obfuscate them like a dirty secret.  On my bank statements (from FNB) it has a whole column dedicated to them!  It has &#8220;Amount/Balance/Accrued Bank Charges&#8221; columns &#8211; and it also has another entry where it actually adds them up and takes them from your account.  I really don&#8217;t see how 22seven could make this any clearer.</p>
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		<title>By: Matthew Alexander Barnes</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69611</link>
		<dc:creator>Matthew Alexander Barnes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jan 2012 15:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69611</guid>
		<description>&quot;Why haven&#039;t they sat down with the banks?&quot; Yeah right, I&#039;m sure all the major banks would have welcomed the idea behind 22seven with open minds. &quot;Sure Christo, we think our customers being able to see a complete picture of their banking charges is a great idea&quot;. 

I would suggest that it&#039;s Christo&#039;s history of taking on the major players that frightens them. If it wasn&#039;t for Saambou&#039;s misadventure in micro lending via Unifer, 20Twenty could well have become a serious upper-end player. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Why haven&#8217;t they sat down with the banks?&#8221; Yeah right, I&#8217;m sure all the major banks would have welcomed the idea behind 22seven with open minds. &#8220;Sure Christo, we think our customers being able to see a complete picture of their banking charges is a great idea&#8221;. </p>
<p>I would suggest that it&#8217;s Christo&#8217;s history of taking on the major players that frightens them. If it wasn&#8217;t for Saambou&#8217;s misadventure in micro lending via Unifer, 20Twenty could well have become a serious upper-end player. </p>
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		<title>By: Eskills</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69603</link>
		<dc:creator>Eskills</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jan 2012 06:56:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69603</guid>
		<description>Services like moneysmart offer a similar service and they don&#039;t require your login credentials... why does this company need that? if they only need a read only access i&#039;m sure they can be content with the bank statement. If by any chance their partner gets hacked, do you get compensation for in convenience as well?? I&#039;m curious...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Services like moneysmart offer a similar service and they don&#8217;t require your login credentials&#8230; why does this company need that? if they only need a read only access i&#8217;m sure they can be content with the bank statement. If by any chance their partner gets hacked, do you get compensation for in convenience as well?? I&#8217;m curious&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Alan Alston</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69602</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Alston</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jan 2012 06:40:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69602</guid>
		<description>You&#039;d think 22seven would at least have opened some form of communication with the banks before they launched; detailing what they&#039;re planning on doing, and planning as how best to work together with the banks in freeing up their customers&#039; financial data - which belongs to said customer in the 1st place. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;d think 22seven would at least have opened some form of communication with the banks before they launched; detailing what they&#8217;re planning on doing, and planning as how best to work together with the banks in freeing up their customers&#8217; financial data &#8211; which belongs to said customer in the 1st place. </p>
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		<title>By: Dave Glazier</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69596</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Glazier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Jan 2012 16:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69596</guid>
		<description>Agree that it is unfair to suggest this Simon.

On the topic in general... We must be clear that the act of requesting one’s sensitive personal details (PINs, passwords) is a direct contravention of the industry-wide standard anti-phishing message of ‘never divulge these details to anyone’. 

The ability of this statement to be communicated and understood with absolutely no exceptions is fundamental to ensuring the security of ALL online customers’ security.

Your writing reflects the frame of reference from which it has emanated: that of a highly intelligent man who is - in the first place - not likely to fall victim to phishing and online fraud.

I&#039;m sure you&#039;ll agree the ability to understand issues from another&#039;s perspective is a goal to which we all continually strive. In this specific case I suggest to you that there exist those who are less capable than yourself of distinguishing between a valid/legal PFM integrator and a phishing site, those for whom any exception to the golden rule of never divulging private information, will pose a risk.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agree that it is unfair to suggest this Simon.</p>
<p>On the topic in general&#8230; We must be clear that the act of requesting one’s sensitive personal details (PINs, passwords) is a direct contravention of the industry-wide standard anti-phishing message of ‘never divulge these details to anyone’. </p>
<p>The ability of this statement to be communicated and understood with absolutely no exceptions is fundamental to ensuring the security of ALL online customers’ security.</p>
<p>Your writing reflects the frame of reference from which it has emanated: that of a highly intelligent man who is &#8211; in the first place &#8211; not likely to fall victim to phishing and online fraud.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure you&#8217;ll agree the ability to understand issues from another&#8217;s perspective is a goal to which we all continually strive. In this specific case I suggest to you that there exist those who are less capable than yourself of distinguishing between a valid/legal PFM integrator and a phishing site, those for whom any exception to the golden rule of never divulging private information, will pose a risk.</p>
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		<title>By: Greg Mahlknecht</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69595</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg Mahlknecht</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Jan 2012 16:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69595</guid>
		<description>Trusting their security partner doesn&#039;t mean any kind of endorsement of the site.  I handed my details over to check it out - didn&#039;t like what I saw and have since closed my account with them.  I&#039;m the opposite of on board, and handed my bank login detals to them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Trusting their security partner doesn&#8217;t mean any kind of endorsement of the site.  I handed my details over to check it out &#8211; didn&#8217;t like what I saw and have since closed my account with them.  I&#8217;m the opposite of on board, and handed my bank login detals to them.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69593</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Jan 2012 10:56:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69593</guid>
		<description>Well your actions clearly indicate you are on board. Otherwise, why did you hand over your bank login details to them?

Interestingly in your article you indicated that some time last year you met MD of Yodlee, Jason O’Shaughnessy. Do you mind sharing reasons for your meeting? Me thinks you knew about this development before launch and took time to investigate it.

Anyway, i am not against this service. It is innovative. However, i just think they should have approached the banks before launch. Also, their monthly charges of R 70 a month is too high considering that banks will charge from about R 85 a month for a cheque account.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well your actions clearly indicate you are on board. Otherwise, why did you hand over your bank login details to them?</p>
<p>Interestingly in your article you indicated that some time last year you met MD of Yodlee, Jason O’Shaughnessy. Do you mind sharing reasons for your meeting? Me thinks you knew about this development before launch and took time to investigate it.</p>
<p>Anyway, i am not against this service. It is innovative. However, i just think they should have approached the banks before launch. Also, their monthly charges of R 70 a month is too high considering that banks will charge from about R 85 a month for a cheque account.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan Benington</title>
		<link>http://www.techcentral.co.za/banks-train-their-guns-on-start-up-22seven/28822/comment-page-1/#comment-69592</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Benington</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Jan 2012 08:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.techcentral.co.za/?p=28822#comment-69592</guid>
		<description>Christo, you and I were actively going about about &quot;creating a visual dashboard view&quot; for customers 11 years ago and Absa pulled the plug on it. And now you&#039;re going to do it? Disingenuous, I believe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Christo, you and I were actively going about about &#8220;creating a visual dashboard view&#8221; for customers 11 years ago and Absa pulled the plug on it. And now you&#8217;re going to do it? Disingenuous, I believe.</p>
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